This is what I have been asked by many of my fellow Computer animation students. Yes, I am a belly dancer (and a gothic one at that), I have been belly dancing since the 5th grade but I have been drawing since the 3rd grade. I am also a student for computer animation in one of the greatest Universities yet the majority of the students are male and us few girls dont get the enough respect, understanding job wise from the students or even the teachers. Just imagine...my class has 70 students and only 5 are girls. Now you may be wondering about the tittle. You see i was with a group of my friends (2 girls including me and 4 boys) and we were all talking about ways we try to stay healthy and have fun other than school So i answered "Well...I belly dance...and i love it...its fun and i might even travel for a weekend to preform in California". One of the boys asked me "So...what are you doing here?" Im sorry I might be a bit fiery about this but, just because I am a belly dancer doesnt make me a lesser computer animator than him. I have been asked this by a few male students and looked down upon by many and this is starting to upset me, I even get this from the teachers! No matter how good i may be in my work and how responsible I get no respect as a computer animator or a girl. I came to this tribe to share my story because i need some shout outs, I also wondered who here has had similar situations???Blessings to all!
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Mon, May 5, 2008 - 8:02 PMI go to an obsessive and snobby womens college in New England; everyone here wants to be the next Hillary, some kind of megabux banker, or something along those lines. So when I went into my first day of Arabic the professor asked why we wanted to learn the language. Everyone pretty much answered that they were studying it because they want to be in politics or whatever serious business they are into. When it came to me I said it was because I am a bellydancer and I wanted to know more about the culture from which the dance came from (and I'd also like to learn what the songs are all about). A lot of people kind of rolled their eyes or just thought I was ridiculous but later on in the year when the TA found me at the Campus Center she said that out of all the Arabic classes she has helped with at my school, that wast truly the best reason she has ever heard and she was glad someone had appreciation for the language and culture and just didn't want to use it as some kind of business tool.
But yeah, people tend to find the bellydance thing ridiculous here. And bellydance is only the least of my "weird" doings...
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Mon, May 5, 2008 - 8:17 PMI have such words about male insecurity in the art world and shriveled nuts....
The funny thing is, most of the animators I know who work in the choice companies (like Pixar, Disney, and the big Silicon Valley and LA game outfits etc) are women.
Perhaps they know this as well, and it scares the shit of them ;)
So BD is already got you halfway to CA. Next time, ask THEM what they're doing there and how much do they enjoy their parents' basement?
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Wed, May 7, 2008 - 12:42 PMTempest, my gothessssssssss. You always put things so perfectly. You really lighten up the days when you comment things. :)
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Thu, May 8, 2008 - 6:25 PMTempest has the best thoughts when it comes to these things! Mwahaha! You made me laugh so hard! ;-p
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Mon, May 5, 2008 - 10:15 PMIs it possible that your fellow student meant his comment in a good way?
When I read your original post, I interpreted the "Why are you here?" remark as meaning, "If you are a bellydancer who is good enough to travel to perform, then why are you wasting your talent here when you could be doing such a cool thing as bellydancing for a living?" -
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Mon, May 5, 2008 - 10:16 PMoops - I hit post before I was finished.
The other thing that crossed my mind is that he meant, "If you love to bellydance so much, then why are you studying animation instead of dancing?"
Maybe the way you talked about how much you love to dance made him wonder why you would go to school for something else. -
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Tue, May 6, 2008 - 5:11 AMI went to a military school... there were twelve girls in my graduating class of 250. I understand.
(ha ha now that I think about it... it's not much different, I'm in construction field, there are 3 women one site (out of 75-100 peeps maybe?), one is a welder... she is kind of scary actually.... one of the compliance officer- she stays inside all day and the other is me.... and I wear man pants and regular t-shirts... and they ask me why? so you dumb shits will do your job and not watch me... and hardly no--one knows I dance... it's safer)
We were asked consistently as rats (little knobs, plebs, what have you as the militant introduction to the system) why are you here, why don't you go home. It happened to the girls a lot. I would say of teh 28 or 30 that started, oen quarter of them wanted their MRS degree. A quarter of them wanted some verification of themselves... the rest of us wanted an edcuation and wanted to seriously have careers in the military.
It doesn't matter what they think, it only matters that you know why you are there and you do your best... you do your job. Time will tell and time will gain their respect, and it can't be bought, it can't be shuffled around, it can only be earned. Your reputation takes a life time to build and seconds to destroy... in those cirumstances it's even more hazy, but you will come to find there are people who will respect you for being a beauitful intelligent woman who is there for the right reasons. And those people will be good friends to you, forever. My best friends from college are men, and I love them dearly for the support they were to me when I was low.
Tempest is right... they are afraid of confident women. And when they get all huffy you can always say, look my balls are bigger than yours. My life is outside the norm, I do things differently.. .what can you say you did? I love my life and I love what I do... if you can't handle it go away... just because you are unhappy with your pathetic excuse for a life doesn't mean you have to knock on mine to make yourself feel better.
=) good luck! -
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Tue, May 6, 2008 - 7:28 AMIsn't it funny how by doing something we love or want to do we can make others so uncomfortable. I hear this same crap from time to time. Usually it's "Why are you reading that when it has nothing to do with what you do?" or "If you spend all your time dancing why do you need to know this stuff?" I have a thirst for knowledge, knowledge of any kind. So what if it doesn't have to do with dancing. I enjoy being multi-faceted, thank you. What my usual response to this kind of small-mindedness is, "Excuse me, but I cannot help it if my quest for knowledge or my attempts to broaden my horizons make you uncomfortable. That would be your own personal issue. Now if you'll excuse me....." -
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Wed, May 7, 2008 - 12:37 PMJanelle,
I suppose it's about people's difficulties to handle someone who actually gets things done WITHOUT being forced to do them. They envy your energy and ability to actually LIKE doing things they know "look good if you do them", but they cannot bring themselves to doing it. Envy makes people say really stupid things...
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Wed, May 7, 2008 - 10:11 AMI'd just look at the next guy blankly and ask him if he's ever considered taking up a hobby or playing a musical instrument. If he says yes, ask he why he thinks bellydance is any different, to keep someone from studying computer antimation. If he says no, just smile and say that you enjoy doing different things, including visual art.
Bellydancing strikes me as a great way to learn about anatomy and body movement for antimation, incidentally. -
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Wed, May 7, 2008 - 10:55 AMDefinitely... I'm an academic advisor and 2 of the 3 art majors I've seen for registration for next fall have signed up for our local university belly dancing class as well as a physics major (all female).
=)
*grumbles incoherently about gender roles and male privilege then goes back to her morning coffee*
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Wed, May 7, 2008 - 11:09 AMThank gals for all your support and similar stories. It makes me feel much better about the situation. Now i know i have a few come backs to the guys. Your all wonderful women! Go sisters! <3
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A dancer is a dancer, is a dancer...
Wed, May 7, 2008 - 12:35 PMBut a dancer can't be anything but a dancer. I got the question what I do when I'm not bellydancing at a gig. I asked him to guess, and after a couple of minutes he "knew"; and guessed I was a stripper. JUST A LITTLE BIT off, perhaps. Physiotherapist- stripper- physiotherapist- stripper... Same shit?
I think that men want to consider dancing women as cute, cuddly, harmless and nice visual objects (whom they perhaps might get to shag at some point...). It's not fair, according to them, that we should b both nice to look at, smart and independent. Their little penises and hollow egos can't take that kind of combinations. And if we, God forbid, would turn out to do what they do, and even BETTER, it's too much to handle.
His reactions say more about him than you. -
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Re: A dancer is a dancer, is a dancer...
Wed, May 7, 2008 - 12:48 PM"But a dancer can't be anything but a dancer."
That's a very good point. I relatively recently read in a dance magazine (you know, one of those that is about modern and ballet dancing) a reply to a letter where the person was saying the classic his or her parents did not get the whole idea of pursuing a dance career, etc. Anyway, the person giving the advice said that, unless you are a dancer, very few people can understand the need to dance and be a dancer. She was saying that, out of the arts, dance was the one that required the most out of your brain to fully express yourself as it taps into the emotions and the physical and the mental too and, as such, nothing else feels quite as whole. That seemed rather accurate to me... and, yeah, your little line there reminded me of it. ;) -
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Re: A dancer is a dancer, is a dancer...
Thu, May 8, 2008 - 9:15 AMWhat you've all said is so true. Often times I've noticed, just recently in a local talent show, that dancers get pushed to the back burner. Our art is not recognized as a real thing for some reason. I was in a local talent show with part of one of the troupes I dance with about a month ago. There were a couple of other dance groups, one of which was a hip-hop group who were fanfreakintastic. None of the dance groups made it to the finals. It was like we weren't really included. People liked it, but they didn't get it.
But we will change all of that, after we take over the world.
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Re: A dancer is a dancer, is a dancer...
Thu, May 8, 2008 - 9:59 AMYesssss, and take over the world we will. I've conquered the capital of Sweden last weekend, and Gothenburg is already mine. *moahahahahaaaaa* What about other progress in the world? -
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Re: A dancer is a dancer, is a dancer...
Thu, May 8, 2008 - 3:06 PMshit, i even get asked time and again, "why are you re-reading a book that you've already read???" let alone 'why are you here in this group when you don't belong"
haven't people figured out by now that ... [gasp] ... we're not all exactly the same in every single way?
it would save people half of their lifetime expenditure of effort and grief if they could just absorb and sanely deal with this one little factoid. -
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Re: A dancer is a dancer, is a dancer...
Fri, May 9, 2008 - 8:13 AMOh, I hate the "re-reading book" question. And they ask, "Doesn't it end the same as it did last time?" Those are the times I wish I had my chainsaw handy.
I have made my little townsfolk my minions. They will aid in the world domination. Next it is on to the big city.
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Fri, May 9, 2008 - 2:53 PMElectrical engineer and mechanical engineer by education and a rocket scientist by trade (yes, really).
In school, I had problems like what you talk about (at least undergrad, by grad school it isn't as bad). I had to prove I "belonged" in classes and was left out of quite a few study groups. Towards the end of my career, I became much more accepted though.
Since entering the working world, I've been pretty fortunate at being around people who are fine with me being a woman and an engineer. I keep the dance and work separate but I also don't hide it and I haven't had too much trouble with it. There are still some "Good ole' boys" who look down on women, especially ones doing something alternative (I was stopped and asked why I had extra holes in my ears by a senior engineer once). I also once worked for a guy who felt women should wear mini-skirts, low-cut tops, and correct his spelling with an adorable giggle. I got out of that situation but it wasn't fun and left me with a pretty sour taste in my mouth. But he was threatened by anyone smarter than him, too.
Sorry to hear you're getting such a bad reaction. :( Just keep doing what you love. -
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Re: "Then...why are you here?"
Fri, May 9, 2008 - 3:19 PMDesdemona,
I hear you on that "Women should be cute and quiet and for our (men's) pleasure. On the "You should wear [whatever]..." I actually have said that men should wear a wedlock (thing that explodes if you move too far from it's peer) tying him to the trashbin where he and his opinions belong...
I am so sick and tired of this "Women only exist to elicit the existence of men" thing. *!!!* We're allowed to dance, if we're cute and harmless and appeal to their sexual fantasies. But engineering? No, that's "their" domain... :/
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